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asociación civil
Ip. unt.

Glossary entry

Spanish term or phrase:

patrimonio de la asociación

English translation:

assets of the Association

Added to glossary by Yvonne Gallagher
Jan 18, 2011 22:25
13 yrs ago
10 viewers *
Spanish term

patrimonio de la asociación

Spanish to English Law/Patents Law (general)
http://www.dgr.gub.uy/requisitos/estatuto_asoc_civiles.htm
Créase una asociación civil que se regirá por los presentes estatutos y por las leyes y reglamentos aplicables, cuya sede será en el Departamento de Montevideo.
El patrimonio de la asociación estará constituido por:
a) Los aportes ordinarios de los asociados que la Comisión Directiva establezca con carácter general.
b) Las contribuciones de origen público o privado y las donaciones y legados a favor de la misma.
c) Todo aporte extraordinario a cargo de los asociados que la Asamblea General establezca de acuerdo con la naturaleza de la Institución.
Proposed translations (English)
4 +8 assets of the Association
3 +3 financial resources
4 +2 the capital of the Association
4 -1 the patrimony of the association
Change log

Jan 26, 2011 21:19: Yvonne Gallagher Created KOG entry

Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (1): philgoddard

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Discussion

Virginia Koolhaas Jan 19, 2011:
Bill "Recursos patrimoniales" is just another way, a more 'elegant' way of saying "Patrimonio"; this is how it usually appears on Uruguayan bylaws/Articles of Iincoporation etc
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 19, 2011:
Virginia. Fine. Recursos Patrimoniales would have been easy. It is far wider than Patrimonio. But let's leave it there.
Virginia Koolhaas Jan 19, 2011:
Bill I don't want to go on with the discussion, but believe me, "Recursos Patrimoniales" or "Patrimonio" is definitely referring to "Capital" as it is directly referring to an account on the balance sheet whether referring to "cooperatives" (I don't know where did I get the idea that it was a cooperative, I must have confused with another question...) or "non-profit organizations" (as the case here, despite Fabio's refusal to translate it that way).
I see this all the time and have translated many time and "capital social", "reservas", "ajustes y reexpresiones contables", "resultados acumulados" are all items of the Capital account (or Equity). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balance_sheet
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 19, 2011:
Virginia. In your link regarding cooperatives it states:
Artículo 52. (Recursos patrimoniales).- Son recursos de naturaleza patrimonial de las cooperativas para el cumplimiento de su objeto social, los siguientes:
1) El capital social.
2) Los fondos patrimoniales especiales.
3) Las reservas legales, estatutarias y voluntarias.
4) Las donaciones, legados y recursos análogos que reciban destinados a incrementar el patrimonio.
5) Los recursos que se deriven de los otros instrumentos de capitalización.
6) Los ajustes provenientes de las reexpresiones monetarias o de valuación.
7) Los resultados acumulados.

The term 'recursos patrimoniales' would I think be the term which the legislator had in mind in our context here. It would certainly avoid all this discussion. And it also takes us back to Robert's term.

It is by no means uncommon for legislators to misuse terms. The courts are full of cases where legislative terms have to be clarified and the usual criterion, at least in England, is What did the Legislator intend?
PS. If I'm going on too much just say so.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 19, 2011:
Virginia, finally This type of body CANNOT be a cooperative. When skimming your reference I saw:
"El empleo del vocablo "cooperativa", o el de "cooperación" o sus derivados, ya sea como denominación, marca o nombre comercial, queda prohibido a toda persona que no se ajuste a las disposiciones de la presente ley."
So it ain't a cooperative!!!

I would not dispute that asociaciones civiles may have de facto 'capital' in accounting terms but I think here the term patrimonio covers more than this and 'capital' must be wrong.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 19, 2011:
Virginia. I agree as to cooperatives. Your link makes that clear. But then cooperatives are formed for essentially mercantile purposes under a different organisational system. Looking at the link in the question there is no reference to capital at all. In fact these bylaws are extremely short and simple, appropriate to what are basically small clubs and groups. I could imagine one of these associations maybe running the local football pitch or some such. I may be totally wrong of course. Finally, these items mentioned, aportes ordinarios at least, would cover say annual subscriptions which would constitute income, not capital. Do these organisations not have any income?? If they did would it not be included under the term patrimonio in the sense used??
Virginia Koolhaas Jan 19, 2011:
Bill, This type of associations (and particularly "cooperativas") do have a capital as such; the Law that regulates these entities specifically states so (at least this is how it goes in Uruguay). Besides, "financial resources" is too generic; it does not convey the full meaning.
Here's the Law: http://www.parlamento.gub.uy/leyes/AccesoTextoLey.asp?Ley=18...
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 19, 2011:
I agree with Virginia but.. In this context, of a non-mercantile entity, I think it would be inappropriate to extrapolate terms used in business. Patrimonio can often be translated as 'assets and liabilities' but then the section only refers to assets. Capital would be wrong because it does not have a 'capital' as such and it would be misleading to use it. I think on balance it would be best to plump for something non-commercial sounding hence I think Robert's take is probably the best. I think the legislator here has used an inappropriate term, or at least defined it incompletely.
Virginia Koolhaas Jan 19, 2011:
"Patrimonio" nunca es "assets" (activos) Activos (Assets) y Patrimonio (Capital, Equity, Net worth, etc depende a qué exactamente se estén refieriendo) son dos cuentas, dos capítulos del Estado contable (balance) totalmente distintas, por lo cual no se puede traducir por "assets".
Activos - Pasivo = Patrimonio ( o Activo = Pasivo + Patrimonio), es la ecuación contable básica y por lo tanto "Patrimonio" nunca puede traducirse por "Assets" (es . Menos en este caso donde habla de "aportes ordinarios de los asociados" y otro tipo de aportes y contribuciones que claramente forman parte de la cuenta Capital, rubro que por definición integra el Patrimonio.
Por lo expresado, en este caso la mejor opción, en mi humilde opinión, es "Capital" (como propuso TechLaw)

Proposed translations

+8
12 mins
Selected

assets of the Association

or Association assets

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 mins (2011-01-18 22:40:46 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

ALSO
RESOURCES/SOURCES OF FUNDING

Pledging association assets. (1) The assets and securities of an association may not be pledged to secure its borrowed money or for any other purpose ...
data.opi.mt.gov/bills/mca/32/2/32-2-405.htm

1 Mar 2002 ... Although it may not be the first thing in the CEO's job description, protecting an association's assets is a primary responsibility of every ...
www.allbusiness.com/specialty-businesses/non.../124411-1.ht... - Cached

Assets and sources of funding. Article 27. The membership fees paid by the members of the Association shall by used for funding of the activities of the ...
www.franchise-slovenia.net/index.php?stran=assets - Cached



--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 7 days (2011-01-26 21:08:49 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Thanks. Glad to help
Peer comment(s):
agree Grosso
1 min
gracías Gabriela:-)
agree Marcela Dutra : Yes, either of your two alternatives sounds good to me
2 mins
many thanks Marcela:-)
agree philgoddard
2 mins
many thanks Phil:-)
agree kalungo
36 mins
many thanks kalungo:-)
agree jacana54 (X)
1 hr
gracías Lucia:-)
disagree Virginia Koolhaas : assets = activos; capital (in this case) = patrimonio / capital = assets - liabilities/ capital+liabilities = assets; "patrimonio" includes profits - losses (net profit) whereas assets does not
1 hr
have to disagree with you
agree Claudia Reynaud
4 hrs
thanks you Claudia:-)
neutral Bill Harrison (X) : I suspect they intended this but it is not what it says. Sources of funding would be OK though and would make a much better answer in my view.
8 hrs
OK Bill point taken, but I think either works here
agree AllegroTrans
10 hrs
many thanks Allegro:-)
agree Adriana Rubinstein
18 hrs
many thanks Adriana:-)
agree Ed Wilcox (X)
21 hrs
Thank you Ed:-)
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
+3
11 mins

financial resources

suerte
Peer comment(s):
agree Mónica Algazi
2 hrs
Thanks so much!
agree Mónica Sauza
3 hrs
many thanks!
agree Bill Harrison (X) : Hesitantly. But am arguing your corner on this in the discussion.
7 hrs
Something went wrong...
-1
12 mins

the patrimony of the association

the association's assets
Peer comment(s):
disagree AllegroTrans : not a word generally used in English
10 hrs
Something went wrong...
+2
53 mins

the capital of the Association

("capital" is the term which accountants use, even though the association may be nonprofit.)
(If you say "assets", this is extremely unidiomatic (i.e. erroneous) from the standpoint of formal accounting.)
Peer comment(s):
agree Virginia Koolhaas : I couldn't agree more
35 mins
agree Mónica Algazi : También
1 hr
neutral Bill Harrison (X) : Actually I disagree but do not wish to be dogmatic on the subject. Capital is far too narrow in this context.
8 hrs
Something went wrong...
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