Alleged mechanical translation Thread poster: Isabell Donath
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Isabell Donath
Germany
Local time: 02:28
Member (2005)
English to German
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A customer claims that my translation was done mechanically and is not a human translation. I have demanded to see my file with all corrections - how else can I give a comment or defend myself? Of course, it is about the fee/payment, but here is the accusation of FRAUD! How can I defend myself, i.e. prove my own translation towards the customer? Thank you!
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 01:28
Member (2008)
Italian to English
| Do it with Deepl | Dec 11, 2021 |
Isabell Donath wrote:
A customer claims that my translation was done mechanically and is not a human translation. I have demanded to see my file with all corrections - how else can I give a comment or defend myself? Of course, it is about the fee/payment, but here is the accusation of FRAUD! How can I defend myself, i.e. prove my own translation towards the customer? Thank you!
Take the same text, translate it with Deepl or Google Translate, and then highlight all the things that are wrong, or that you did better. Send it to your client.
| | | | Adieu 
Ukrainian to English
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| Probably scammers | Dec 11, 2021 |
Unless they're trying a self-learning MT training algorithm on their workflow and have somehow managed to outwit themselves.
If they later proceed to connect the self-learned MT to a project with the same source file but NOT the translation memory from it, they might well get a result that shows the entire thing as pre-translated exactly the way you did it... but color coded as 0% matches from MT.
| | | | Michael Newton
United States
Local time: 20:28
Japanese to English
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| alleged mechanical translation | Dec 12, 2021 |
Please stand up for yourself. This is a ploy to avoid paying. Recently I had a client who insisted that my translation was generated by Google. It was a complex pharmaceutical translation and I have had years of Japanese-English pharma translation experience. Despite my denials, the exchange became heated verging on the abusive. Finally I gave up as I knew there was no way of dissuading them let alone collecting. When I went to place a "1" on their Blue Board post, it turned on that a "krisztina... See more Please stand up for yourself. This is a ploy to avoid paying. Recently I had a client who insisted that my translation was generated by Google. It was a complex pharmaceutical translation and I have had years of Japanese-English pharma translation experience. Despite my denials, the exchange became heated verging on the abusive. Finally I gave up as I knew there was no way of dissuading them let alone collecting. When I went to place a "1" on their Blue Board post, it turned on that a "krisztina" was in the habit of assuming the identify of this Turkish agency based in Germany. As a sidebar, I recently had a client who complained about the quality of a complex legal translation involving a famous lawsuit going on in Tokyo. He was not specific and I figured this was a ploy to avoid paying.
Over the course of one month, I sent him a series of certified letters requesting that he specify the problems (grammar, syntax, words of art, readability). Should he do so, I would be willing to make an adjustment to the fee. I knew that he would probably not reply but this was my way of weaving a spider's web should I be forced to take him to court. He refused to specify the "problems". I sent him a bill for the full amount indicating that had he been willing to communicate with me and specify the "problems", he would be paying less.
He ended up paying in full. ▲ Collapse
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| They bear the burden of proof | Dec 12, 2021 |
Isabell Donath wrote:
A customer claims that my translation was done mechanically and is not a human translation. I have demanded to see my file with all corrections - how else can I give a comment or defend myself? Of course, it is about the fee/payment, but here is the accusation of FRAUD! How can I defend myself, i.e. prove my own translation towards the customer? Thank you!
At this stage, you don't have to prove anything. They have to provide proof to back up their claim.
As others said, this may show they have no intention to pay you for your work, so act accordingly to protect yourself against such eventuality.
[Edited at 2021-12-12 06:13 GMT]
| | | | | Invoice them | Dec 12, 2021 |
I agree with what others have said.
Tell them that if they provide evidence that your translation is substandard you will respond to their concerns but that if they can't you will be invoicing in full.
If you get no response, send them an invoice and be prepared to follow up with the normal means of debt recovery if they don't pay.
In practice, the size of the job will probably dictate how much effort and money it's worth spending to pursue the debt, but ... See more I agree with what others have said.
Tell them that if they provide evidence that your translation is substandard you will respond to their concerns but that if they can't you will be invoicing in full.
If you get no response, send them an invoice and be prepared to follow up with the normal means of debt recovery if they don't pay.
In practice, the size of the job will probably dictate how much effort and money it's worth spending to pursue the debt, but you can at least leave them bad feedback to warn others. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | | | I've had this! | Dec 17, 2021 |
It was through a previously very professional agency that I've worked with for years, but I'm cutting them loose now due to their complete failure to defend me and the end product.
The end client even compared sections of my translation against Google Translate output. Due to the type of text, some of the short repetitive sections were in fact almost identical. However, the differences in the longer sections were extremely noticeable, and in those cases, the client had simply put in... See more It was through a previously very professional agency that I've worked with for years, but I'm cutting them loose now due to their complete failure to defend me and the end product.
The end client even compared sections of my translation against Google Translate output. Due to the type of text, some of the short repetitive sections were in fact almost identical. However, the differences in the longer sections were extremely noticeable, and in those cases, the client had simply put in their preferred non-native-speakerisms and told me my English was poor. Lol. The agency's decision not to pay me for a job worth several hundred euros was less amusing, though.
My inner cynic says it's no coincidence that this happened right in the middle of lockdown, and the end client's business had been brought to a standstill by Covid. Their staff were all sitting around doing nothing so were trying to recoup costs, basically.
Anyway, I think freelancer terms and conditions are necessary for clients and agencies like this. That way you can make it crystal clear from the start that your work is all your own, and you can specifically name and describe your work procedures, thus making it clear what you will and won't accept in terms of complaints. Although in all honesty, given the current state of the market, I don't think even that would have any effect. ▲ Collapse
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| Wow, that's awful | Dec 17, 2021 |
Claire Titchmarsh wrote:
It was through a previously very professional agency that I've worked with for years, but I'm cutting them loose now due to their complete failure to defend me and the end product.
The end client even compared sections of my translation against Google Translate output. Due to the type of text, some of the short repetitive sections were in fact almost identical. However, the differences in the longer sections were extremely noticeable, and in those cases, the client had simply put in their preferred non-native-speakerisms and told me my English was poor. Lol. The agency's decision not to pay me for a job worth several hundred euros was less amusing, though.
My inner cynic says it's no coincidence that this happened right in the middle of lockdown, and the end client's business had been brought to a standstill by Covid. Their staff were all sitting around doing nothing so were trying to recoup costs, basically.
Anyway, I think freelancer terms and conditions are necessary for clients and agencies like this. That way you can make it crystal clear from the start that your work is all your own, and you can specifically name and describe your work procedures, thus making it clear what you will and won't accept in terms of complaints. Although in all honesty, given the current state of the market, I don't think even that would have any effect.
Did you challenge that at all? A debt of several hundreds of euros sounds like it would be worth legal action against them.
| | | | Adieu
Ukrainian to English
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| Actually, that is unfortunately the "sweet spot" | Dec 17, 2021 |
If it were thousands, it would almost certainly invite legal disputes.
Sums in the hundreds, however, are sadly typically more of an "angry emails and bad yelp reviews" thing. Although it may depend on the ease and simplicity of filing small claims in your jurisdiction and whether or not said small claims can reach and affect the dodgy client at all.
Rachel Waddington wrote: Claire Titchmarsh wrote:
It was through a previously very professional agency that I've worked with for years, but I'm cutting them loose now due to their complete failure to defend me and the end product.
The end client even compared sections of my translation against Google Translate output. Due to the type of text, some of the short repetitive sections were in fact almost identical. However, the differences in the longer sections were extremely noticeable, and in those cases, the client had simply put in their preferred non-native-speakerisms and told me my English was poor. Lol. The agency's decision not to pay me for a job worth several hundred euros was less amusing, though.
My inner cynic says it's no coincidence that this happened right in the middle of lockdown, and the end client's business had been brought to a standstill by Covid. Their staff were all sitting around doing nothing so were trying to recoup costs, basically.
Anyway, I think freelancer terms and conditions are necessary for clients and agencies like this. That way you can make it crystal clear from the start that your work is all your own, and you can specifically name and describe your work procedures, thus making it clear what you will and won't accept in terms of complaints. Although in all honesty, given the current state of the market, I don't think even that would have any effect.
Did you challenge that at all? A debt of several hundreds of euros sounds like it would be worth legal action against them.
| | | | Tony Keily
Local time: 02:28
Italian to English
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| I've had something similar | Dec 17, 2021 |
Claire Titchmarsh wrote: a previously very professional agency that I've worked with for years, but I'm cutting them loose now due to their complete failure to defend me and the end product.
The agency IS your client! When they QC your work and pass it that should oblige them to pay you. It's all there implicitly in the translation standards most agencies boast: they are obliged to revise your translation, and if they don't come back with any complaints at that point... ciao.
This "end-client" crap is really tiresome. Agencies shouldn't just stand out of the way like toreros, leaving lists of silly queries/comments/objections from their "very important" clients to come charging at you, when this isn't part of the translation process. I've taken to objecting to this even when agencies offer to pay me for my time, on the grounds that I don't offer online English lessons (although obviously I'll answer justified end-client queries made in good faith).
I like you "inner cynic".
[Edited at 2021-12-17 16:52 GMT]
| | | | Robin Dufaye
France
Local time: 02:28
Spanish to French
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| Breach of NDA... Very risky | Dec 20, 2021 |
Tom in London wrote: Isabell Donath wrote:
A customer claims that my translation was done mechanically and is not a human translation. I have demanded to see my file with all corrections - how else can I give a comment or defend myself? Of course, it is about the fee/payment, but here is the accusation of FRAUD! How can I defend myself, i.e. prove my own translation towards the customer? Thank you!
Take the same text, translate it with Deepl or Google Translate, and then highlight all the things that are wrong, or that you did better. Send it to your client.
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